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12 Responses to “ Daily Breakfast 493 - Tithing ”

1. 
   Fr. Roderick Jun 4th, 2008 at 10:26 am

   I talked about the difference in fuel prices between the US and the Netherlands, but didn’t have numbers ready. So here they are:

   in the U.S., gas prices are approaching $4 a Gallon. In the Netherlands however, the price for one Gallon of unleaded fuel is 5.97 Euro, i.e. $9.22 USD a Gallon!

2. 
   Jeff Jun 4th, 2008 at 3:22 pm

   A little perspective:

   Yes, Americans complain to readily, but Europeans have the advantage of excellent public transportation, from the bus to light and heavy rail systems. The United States once had the most extensive rail system in the world; most cities had light rail and trolly systems, an it was possible to get just about anywhere you really needed to go without a car.

   Unfortunately, that infrastructure was allowed to atrophy, and most Americans are completely dependent upon their car. Additionally, so complete was our devotion to the automobile that most suburban areas are incomprehensibly vast — as if planners wanted to see just how much space they could waste.

   So, we’re very sensitive to increases in fuel prices. It’s not terribly uncommon for many American families to drive a thousand miles or more a week — just commuting to and from work. Yes, gas is much lower here than Europe, but our short-sighted and costly love affair with our cars and poor public transportation infrastructure gives us few other options when oil price spike.

3. 
   Marker Jun 4th, 2008 at 3:51 pm

   A little more perspective…

   The U.S. public transportation infrastructure was not allowed to atrophy because too many people were using the service. It atrophied because gradually fewer people were using it. Automobile and air travel became more affordable and the population chose to use these options. Most city governments could not justify the operating costs required on the old transport systems. Clearly, the people want cars so they can come and go according to their own schedule rather than waiting at a bus stop or train terminal for the public transportation to move on someone else’s timetable. As the price of gas increases, then maybe this preference will change; and I would welcome that. But, unless the country figures out a way to move people to the places they want to go and on a schedule that fits their lives, then people will continue to use their cars. Certainly, there is an upper limit on the price they will pay for gas but I think the price could go much higher before the population changes its driving habits in any meaningful way.

4. 
   Jomichael Jun 5th, 2008 at 4:08 pm

   This is not the first time I have heard you discussing how to budget things as a Catholic. You have mentioned before that you should budget what it takes for you to be comfortable and give the rest away. What I don’t hear is how much should be put away for retirement or as insurance against catastrophe… such as illness or injury. This is a huge issue in the United States, as our Social Security system doesn’t even cover the cost of medication for many of our elderly. As it is, not nearly enough people are saving for their retirement, and that needs to be considered as well. I guess that is where the confusion comes… how much goes toward being comfortable after you are too old to work? I am not a Dave Ramsey listener, but I assume he touches on this from time to time.

5. 
   Jeff Jun 5th, 2008 at 7:34 pm

   Most people do not have the “luxury” of being able to live on 90% of their income. For example, I pay roughly 30% of my income in taxes. Add to this the 10% we tithe…that leaves 60% (or less) of my income for my wife, three children and me. Certainly we are able to do this…but it’s nowhere near the 90% of our income that you state.

6. 
   Bob Jun 5th, 2008 at 8:00 pm

   While talking on cellphones at Mass is something I’ll always object to, I’ll never be too surprised by someone forgetting to turn off their cellphone again. At last Sunday’s Mass, our celebrant’s cellphone rang just after Holy Communion was distributed.

7. 
   St Francis Girl Jun 5th, 2008 at 9:53 pm

   At my parish, a reminder to turn off all electronic devices is made as part of the announcements at the beginning of Mass. I put mine on silent — not even vibrate. The vibrate mode can also be distracting to near by people. One note to prevent further embarrassment, go to the sound options and turn off the “power off” sound effect. There’s nothing like a phone ringing during Mass and then the panic to turn off the phone. Turning off the phone plays music as well unless you disable it. I put my phone on silent before I get out of my car. It is not unusual now to see adults with their Black Berry, iPhone, etc. checking email, texting, web browsing right up till the beginning of Mass.

8. 
   Fr. Roderick Jun 6th, 2008 at 2:53 am

   @Jeff: I’m talking about take-home pay, so after you’ve paid taxes. I pay around 35% taxes (because I have a low income). I don’t know exactly what Dave Ramsey recommends, and the situation is different in the U.S., but my idea is: if I can survive on 100% of my take-home pay, I should be able to survive on 90% of that amount as well.

   But again, as I said in the episode, the Catholic Church doesn’t give numbers. It’s important to give, but how much is up to you.

9. 
   Jeff V. Jun 6th, 2008 at 8:36 am

   A-ha! We have hit, I think, an important point. Do we give 10% of gross (pre-tax) or net (post-tax) pay? Not an insignificant difference. For example: gross income of $100, 30% tax, net income $70. If you tithe 10% of net, it’s $7; gross, it’s $10, nearly half again of net tithing. I was always taught to tithe 10% of gross income.

   I love this “Render unto Caesar what is Caesar’s, and to God what is God’s” discussion!

10. 
    Joe Jun 6th, 2008 at 1:06 pm

    cell phones in church — there was s time in my parish that some people refused to announce to trun off the cell phones because they felt it to be an imposion. NOW, the pastor has an nnouncement at every mass — Turn off your cell phone so you can be turned on to God. Also I heard of one parish that the pastor worked a deal to get a dampening field placed aound the church so that the calls could not reach inside.

11. 
    Jim in Columbus, Ohio Jun 6th, 2008 at 3:31 pm

    I leave the phone in the car for the hour or two when I’m in church or in meetings. I consider coming together with other people more for church or an important meeting more important than an unexpected phone call.

    Don’t all mobil phones have voice mail?

    Unless you are a doctor on call, it’s my impression that nothing is so critical that it can’t wait an hour or two. It’s just rude and inconsiderate to the other church goers and meeting attendees.

    Leaving the phone in the car works well for me and it allows me to enjoy the group time uniterrupted.

    I teach at a local college and dock students 1% evertime the phone rings. It’s the third item on the syllabus. Only one phone call interruption this quarter (40 hours of instruction) and next week is finals.

12. 
    Janet Sipos Jun 6th, 2008 at 6:48 pm

    Dear Fr.Roderick, I just finished listening to DB 493, and have a story to beat all stories about cell phones in church, our priest was talking to another priest that had filled in at a neiboring parish when the regular priest was away. The priest that was filling in was distributing holy communion and a man came up to receive and was talking on his cell phone at the time. When he got up to the priest he kept right on talking and was motioning for the priest to give him the eucharist while he was still talking on the phone. The visiting priest refused until the man got off the phone.

    Now that takes the cake on Rudeness and Gall. I love your podcasts and God Bless. Janet in Montgomery Illinois (near Chicago)

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